Movies to watch (a movie recommendation thread)

[MRCS]

Hello Everybody,

wouldn't it be nice to establish a decent video-abend. The regular excuse in the Ferien? Wir hatten mit "Land and freedom" ja schon einen Film. Nur keinen Termin. Also bitte postet Filmvorschläge oder Orga-Zeugs. Raum, Hardware, Interesse, etc.

Continuism,
Pen²

[D.P. Rubino]

I don't understand German one bit (hey, I'm an American linguist, I only talk good American...lol)

...but "Land and Freedom" is a great movie.. just had to say that.

--dan

[ghost]

Great idea, Pen2, but could you speak English ...wenn es fur dich nicht sehr schwer ist. Die meisten Mietglieder sind nicht Deutsch und die Sprache die wir alle gut benutzen konnen ist Englisch. And this was the best German I can provide without my grammar books and dictionaries.

[MRCS]

Yes I will from now on just speak the the lingua franka here.
The post adressed itself mainly at people in the cologne region. The idea was to continue the fun perhaps on a weekly/biweekly basis, while watching great movies. Great movies like "Land and Freedom" for example. But I guess this forum isn't that much frequented by those people I adressed. I just might restrict the themes of my postings to PIS relevant topics and nothing, ehm, else.

So maybe I can reformulate the topic of this thread:

ARE THERE ANY MOVIES AS GOOD AS 'LAND AND FREEDOM' OUT THERE THAT YOU WOULD RECOMMEND?


Greetings,
Pen²

[Burn]

Well, I don't know "Land and Freedom", so I don't know if these fit in there. But on the background of the seminar, specifically topics such as society, human rights and penal systems, I think mainstream movies like "Malcolm X" (plus related excerpts from "Ali" to juxtapose?), "Fight Club" and "American History X" might be interesting. But only if we don't wanna limit ourselves to non-mainstream films.

On a more philosophical side, I can really recommend the German movie "Die Welt am Draht" (see IMDB www.imdb.com/title/tt0070904/) which is a 1973 rendition of Daniel F. Galouye's novel "Simulacron 3". It's a brilliant movie by German director Rainer Werner Fassbinder, much better than the 1999 Hollywood version "The 13th floor" (well, supposedly much better, since I couldn't bring myself to watch that crap yet).

[dot]

Good idea to start this thread. If I remember correctly, Kay has a provisional list of proposed titles; maybe he can post it here.

Here's what I'd recommend:

[/b] (Chomsky & media -- best documentary I know)
The Corporation (outstanding 3-part doc on capitalist corporations, see IMDb for more details)
The Fog of War (McNamara on Vietnam, revealing & shocking)
Romero -- Tod eines Erzbischofs (Phoenix) + Romero (feature film) (assassination of archbishop Romero; U.S.-backed terrorism in Latin America)
George Orwell - Der Ruf nach Freiheit (great biography + some info on Spanish civil war; BW)
Es begann mit einer Lüge (Kosovo war; ARD)
Ein anderes Amerika (American dissidents; Arte)
War Photographer (James Nachtwey)
[/ul]

And here are some of the documentaries I've been downloading recently that might fit our topic (special list since I've seen them only in part):

There are some more which I have not yet archived, and some others still downloading. A whole bunch of stuff for our purpose is available online.

As for hardware & location, I won't be able to contribute anything, I'm afraid -- apart from a DVD player, if needed.

[MRCS]

@ Dot: Impressive list. I didn'nt know you could download arte and 3sat documentaries. I've seen some of them in sleepless nights. Good stuff. For a specific topic, a specific documentary. "George Orwell - Der Ruf nach Freiheit (great biography + some info on Spanish civil war; BW)" could fit within the "land and freedom" context.

@ Burn: Its the other way round with me. I saw 'the 13th floor', which is an ok movie, but not yet Fassbinders version. Maybe if we could construct a maschine that could transfer the experience...
No wait I think we might as well just watch the movies ...and later construct a maschine that...

regards,
Pen²

[dot]

Frankly, I doubt that films like "Fight Club" or "Ali" fit in the context set by the seminar. Or can a film about fast food and its consequences ("Supersize Me") be a basis for substancial discussion? There may be some political elements in those flicks, but on a rather abstract level, as far as I can see. (Or maybe I just miss the point -- if so, please convince me of the opposite.)

Don't get me wrong: This is not to say that all I posted is great. Maybe all those documentaries turn out to be a total waste of time; as I said, I've watched them only in part. But still, I think we should prefer something a little more straightforward than "Fight Club" or "13th Floor" (haven't seen the latter, but it seems to tend towards "Matrix"-style VR stuff), e.g. reality-based films like "Malcolm X". (However, if we include purely ficticious films, I'd suggest Lars von Trier's impressive "Dogville".)

I'd like to know what others think of this.

[MRCS]

dot:
If we interpret the seminar topic in a narrow sense it will just be more difficult to argue for a movie like 'Fight Club'.
Criticism is in my point of view a mode of responsibility
for a litarary scientist. So a movie watched in our seminar wouldn't have to deal exactly with our topic but it could be made subject to the issues we discussed.

What I mean is you don't have to stick with the Gallilei-thing. Like in Contact with Jodie Foster for example. A movie which promises a lot and then later lets you down (the infamous 'the-alien-looks-like-your-father-scene, more fun the other way round actually).
Fight Club has a lot of issues. It has the gender/sex thing, it has the individual vs. collective (state, whatever), it has good old terrorism as a means for change (politics).

I want to ask for interesting, challenging movies. ''Welt am Draht', I think, could be an eye opener.

Greetings,
PenPen


PS: Please can somebody think of an excuse to watch Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas?!

[dot]

OK, I guess you're right about "Fight Club" (although everybody has already seen that one, I assume). Still, I have my doubts about some of the other films proposed. Concerning "interesting, challenging movies", I'd recommend (again) "Dogville" (170 mins runtime, unfortunately...), and "Jacob's Ladder". And maybe "Dancer in the Dark" or Kieslowski's "A Short Film About Killing". Oh, and I forgot Alan Resnais' wonderful yet shocking documentary "Night and Fog" (Details). Anyway, we should start actually doing something, so I guess we should just meet on Wednesday, watch "Gipfelstürmer", and then talk about how to proceed.

("Fear and Loathing" will be difficult to justify, though -- but I love that film, too. )

[MRCS]

so I guess we should just meet on Wednesday, watch "Gipfelstürmer", and then talk about how to proceed.

I agree.

Penpen

[Burn]

No offense intended, but I just knew that these arguments would come. Sometimes I get the impression that everyone just shrugs off mainstream media as a source of discussion because they are not artsy-fartsy enough. But I will not make a case against media elitism, I want to make one for mainstream films.

A few things to ponder, about the validity of films:
Why is it necessary (for us?) to rely on documentaries or "artistic" movies for a topic to discuss? Because they make points? Because they represent an opinion? Get outta here. Name me one thing that you can't do with mainstream.

In my opinion mainstream media make just as well a base for research and discussion as any documentary, any time. Why? Because mainstream media reflect the tastes of the masses. They cater to the (simple) tastes of the people, try to shape them and in some cases still point out certain issues.

Don't get me wrong, I love good documentaries, interviews and artistic films, the craftsmanship, artistic authenticity etc. But even more I love mainstream shit because I see it for what it is and still can enjoy it.

In any case, whatever we're gonna watch next session, it's all good coz the minds are probably all made up already anyways. So, see y'all on wednesday, I'm outtie...

[MRCS]

Oh No!

Burn is full of hate ;D. I agree with you on the mainstream issue though . Hey, I quoted Star Trek in front of you all and was laughed at. So, no problem with me watching one or the other Hollywood movie (I watch them all the time, actually). I would like to watch Malcom X. Haven't seen it yet. So, no elitist marginalization of mainstream movies here. You elitist bastards.

Greetings,
Penpen

[dot]

No offense taken. But I wasn't trying to make a case against mainstream films. The films I mentioned are not "artsy-fartsy", in my opinion -- at least not more than those proposed by others --, so they were not intended as an "artistic" counter-proposal or something like that.

The point is not that I'm against mainstream films (take a look at those documentaries I posted; they're all taken from mainstream media). I do, however, think that what we select for our sessions should match at least the criterion of "making a point", mainstream or not. What I meant to say was that this point made or the issues raised by the particular film should have the potential to be a basis for valuable discussion -- which will not be the case if 'the point' is simply not interesting, or too difficult to figure out. In fact, I'm somewhat skeptical about the films I mentioned myself.

Now, if I doubt that e.g. "Fight Club" can match this criterion, that's of course just a personal impression that can be easily dismissed, as Marcus did above, in a convincing manner. Thus, my comments were not intended to discredit particular films (which would be just hubris); rather, they were a personal statement about how to select. Maybe I'm just too pragmatic.

[MRCS]

Hey my name is Penpen.


Greetings,

Marcus